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 Post subject: EV costs / repairs / warranty for high mileage
PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2016 5:32 pm 
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toddh wrote:
Seems you got a good price.

Been looking for a White 2014 with low miles like that. Have see a few others in that range, but only with higher miles.

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Higher miles on an EV have less of an technical impact than on a combustion engine car

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silver 2014 vin: 3533 20k miles, 2 x GEM EV
past ev's: 3 yr leaf 30k, 3yr rav4ev 34k


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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:12 am 
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fromport wrote:
toddh wrote:
Seems you got a good price.

Been looking for a White 2014 with low miles like that. Have see a few others in that range, but only with higher miles.

.

Higher miles on an EV have less of an technical impact than on a combustion engine car


How you arrive at that conclusion? You are talking about wear items like brakes, clutch etc?

I like EVs, but I don't see your logic at this stage of their development. Too many people buying extended warranties to keep their EV cost repairs down as they rack up the miles and range degradation is a documented fact.


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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:07 am 
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toddh wrote:
How you arrive at that conclusion? You are talking about wear items like brakes, clutch etc?
I like EVs, but I don't see your logic at this stage of their development. Too many people buying extended warranties to keep their EV cost repairs down as they rack up the miles and range degradation is a documented fact.

http://insideevs.com/ev-vs-ice-maintenance-the-first-100000-miles/

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silver 2014 vin: 3533 20k miles, 2 x GEM EV
past ev's: 3 yr leaf 30k, 3yr rav4ev 34k


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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2016 2:47 pm 
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This article addresses mostly routine Maintenance, which is not the same as reliably or its affects as the vehicle age. It does not cover what are know to be common failures such as motor, battery, DC-DC converter, heater. Tesla, Nissan, Toyota have all had teeth cutting issues. Currently under warranty but what about after?

If everyone was comfortable with their Rav4 aging gracefully there would not be such emphasis on maintaining an extended warranty specifically for the EV components. If it was an ICE RAV4 most would hot even consider the warranty.

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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2016 2:58 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:55 pm
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toddh wrote:
This article addresses mostly routine Maintenance, which is not the same as reliably or its affects as the vehicle age. It does not cover what are know to be common failures such as motor, battery, DC-DC converter, heater. Tesla, Nissan, Toyota have all had teeth cutting issues. Currently under warranty but what about after?

If everyone was comfortable with their Rav4 aging gracefully there would not be such emphasis on maintaining an extended warranty specifically for the EV components. If it was an ICE RAV4 most would hot even consider the warranty.

.

8yr/100.000 warranty on drive train
It is items like dc-dc charger and resistive heater that are costly and why extended warranty is logical.
Since standard warranty is 3 year/36k miles
it doesn't matter if the car 5k miles or is at 25k. you will need extended warranty because of 36 months limit.
I was making suggestion that the milage is less a factor with reliability compared to ICE.
Example is the owner of the rav4ev who had 96k miles on hist car, when (under standard warranty) his battery back was exchanged and only had 10% battery capacity loss

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Entune: plugfed | OpenEvse wifi controlled L1/L2 charging
silver 2014 vin: 3533 20k miles, 2 x GEM EV
past ev's: 3 yr leaf 30k, 3yr rav4ev 34k


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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2016 5:29 pm 
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fromport wrote:
toddh wrote:
This article addresses mostly routine Maintenance, which is not the same as reliably or its affects as the vehicle age. It does not cover what are know to be common failures such as motor, battery, DC-DC converter, heater. Tesla, Nissan, Toyota have all had teeth cutting issues. Currently under warranty but what about after?

If everyone was comfortable with their Rav4 aging gracefully there would not be such emphasis on maintaining an extended warranty specifically for the EV components. If it was an ICE RAV4 most would hot even consider the warranty.

.

8yr/100.000 warranty on drive train
It is items like dc-dc charger and resistive heater that are costly and why extended warranty is logical.
Since standard warranty is 3 year/36k miles
it doesn't matter if the car 5k miles or is at 25k. you will need extended warranty because of 36 months limit.
I was making suggestion that the milage is less a factor with reliability compared to ICE.
Example is the owner of the rav4ev who had 96k miles on hist car, when (under standard warranty) his battery back was exchanged and only had 10% battery capacity loss


I hear what you are saying, but I don't see your point. You stated that higher miles have less of a technical impact than on an ICE, then you point out that one with only 96k had the battery replaced. Only a small percentage of the Rav4 EV's have reached 100k and battery replacements are a reality. How many ICE Rav4's with 100k are needing major motive system replacements costing in the tens of thousands that were results of normal wear and tear?

What happens to owners when they reach 110k? If they paid $1500 years earlier for the extended warranty then they are covered to 125K. But that is still $1500 they spent and what about after that? Only price I have seen on a Rav4 EV battery was $36,000 but that's been a while.

My Acura has 155k and my Insight had over 230K. The technical impact of those miles was faded paint and a cracked dash. I was still averaging nearly the same mpg as when new. My Insight was still getting 70mpg+.

Unfortunately short term I think you will see a lot of EV's prematurely ending up in junk yards due to repair costs. Over time this will change, but until the aftermarket gears up and the prices come down people simply wont come up with the $5,000 - $10,000 to replace a motor or battery on a car worth $7,000 - $20,000. Even now Insurance companies are totaling EVs because of the cost and complications of repairing them vs and ICE.

I like my EV, I will probably never buy another ICE. And they have many advantages but I would never say for this generation of EV aging well or having a long life expectancy will be one of them.

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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:12 pm 
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toddh wrote:
If everyone was comfortable with their Rav4 aging gracefully there would not be such emphasis on maintaining an extended warranty specifically for the EV components. If it was an ICE RAV4 most would hot even consider the warranty.

I think I am headed down the road with no warranty and let mine age gracefully.
Yes I might get stung. Or just part it out and move on if it gets crazy expensive.


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 Post subject: Re: Just bought a 2014 RAV 4 EV! Santa Monica, CA
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 12:46 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:43 am
Posts: 231
Location: Redwood City, CA
toddh wrote:
If everyone was comfortable with their Rav4 aging gracefully there would not be such emphasis on maintaining an extended warranty specifically for the EV components. If it was an ICE RAV4 most would hot even consider the warranty.


Unfortunately it seems that a lot of our RAV4EVs do not age gracefully - they have frequent failures of their EV system components. Thank you Tesla for your great product quality! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: EV costs / repairs / warranty for high mileage
PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:55 pm 
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Location: Los Altos, CA
I think I have seen more posts about people's RAV's being totalled by insurance than traction battery pack replacements under warranty. I think wrecked vehicles will provide a useful source of relatively affordable parts for EVs.

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 Post subject: Re: EV costs / repairs / warranty for high mileage
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 12:03 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 6:33 pm
Posts: 163
Location: Angels Camp
Hi,
I own the Rav4 that had it's battery pack replaced at 96,000 miles under warranty. According to Tony Williams, only 5 Rav 4s have had to have their battery packs replaced. That's less than 0.2% of all Rav 4 EVs. That's pretty low. I now have over 100,000 miles on my Rav. At 96,000 miles my pack was only down about 16 to 17%, so higher mileage is not a big issue on the Rav. Now if your talking 24,000 miles versus 100,000 miles then yeah there is a little difference, but anything less than 30 to 40,000 miles and your not going to see much of a difference. :)

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2012 Blizzard Pearl Rav4 EV
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Picked Up 4/29/2011
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and a Leviton 16 amp L2 EVSE for work
116,500 miles on the Rav as of 08-5-16


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