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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 1:19 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:13 pm
Posts: 1607
Location: Los Altos, CA
TonyWilliams wrote:
I like it, except I want / need a parallel solar system that can make this system "perpetual" power.

Also, I see no reason that an autotransfer switch can't separate the grid tied panels from the grid. We just need a simple method that regulates load. We could have one switch per solar panel that we could manipulate based on load.
You can "AC couple" your existing grid-tied inverter, but you have to be very careful about where and how it is connected so that it works normally when the grid is up and when it is down. The two different inverter systems I've looked at with respect to AC coupling both say that the Grid Tie inverter must be rated less than the battery inverter. Outback power says that you should not connect more than 6kW of AC Coupled Solar to the 8kW Radian Inverter (125% rule). It handles the isolation to the grid and cuts out the solar inverter when the batteries are full. Of course, the best way to connect solar to this kind of system is to use solar charge controllers instead of inverters. They do MPPT tracking and don't have to do DC/AC/DC conversion, they just let through the DC current to the battery at the optimum DC voltage for each string of panels. When the batteries are full, they just stop letting through the current. Alternatively, you can configure the inverter to start selling into the grid when the batteries are full and the charge controllers keep running full blast.

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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:23 am 
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Location: Los Altos, CA
Just for reference, there is a guy in Norway who disassembled some salvage Leaf packs to make his own solar storage system. Their utility pays relatively little for grid feed-in, so it is economically advantageous to consume your own solar generation. Anyway, he did some nice packaging of the Leaf modules in a server rack. Other notables are a BMS that talks to the SMA Sunny Island by CANbus.

Image

His thread at MyNissanLeaf

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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2016 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:30 pm
Posts: 218
Location: San Diego Co
miimura wrote:
Actually, a system built with an Outback Radian and about 40kWh of junkyard EV batteries would be a really nice setup for you guys.


This is very nice, but still requires 48V battery strings. I still look forward to being able to plug into an EV battery directly at higher voltage. It would be nice to integrate an EV into the system without disassembly and reconfiguring the batteries.

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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 6:35 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:54 am
Posts: 15
Install Chademo on your car.

Wire a high voltage chademo plug into a 6kw Grid tie inverter that can take up to 500vdc In the same place you would wire in Solar. SMA would be my favorite. You'll have to some how fool the chademo port to open.

The 6kw grid tie inverter will pull the current its rated for, X 1.25, so between 6000-7500 watts coming from the EV.


Wire the 240ac output from the grid tie inverter into and Outback radian 8048. The grid tie inverter will not see the grid down because the outback inverter creates 240v 60 hz. The grid tie inverter hooked up to the electric car via the chademo port will take the power from the car through the GT inverter, through the Outback inverter and either power the loads in the house or spin the meter backwards if you have a net metering agreement from solar previously. (6000w inverters matches the OB 8048 wattage it can export to the grid and why I picked that wattage inverter)

You will need a 48vdc battery bank to turn on the outback inverter. Sealed agm would work fine. Min 200 amp hour bank. (More amp hours is better if planning to be tottally offgrid and planning on adding solar)

If the grid is active the outback radian can export to grid. But also if you want to be stealth and have the power company not know What you're doing. You can set the outback radian inverter to be in zero export mode. This mode is used in Hawaii where you get Can't export kWh to grid. Or set the outback inverter to go total offgrid mode by turning off the main grid breaker feeding your sub panel.

In offgrid or zero export mode,
When the 48v batteries are full and no loads are being used in the house.
The outback radian will turn off the grid tie inverter by frequency shifting or raising the voltage and tripping off the GT inverter. When the house loads turn on and power is needed the outback inverter will allow the GT inverter to turn back on which will take power from the EV once again.

If you want to add solar to this system. Do so by adding it to the Outback radian via charge controllers. Each Outback FM 80 charge controller can handle apx 4500w of PV. And adding two charge controllers to a XW8048 is maxing it out. Make sure you have a large enough 48v battery bank to handle the extra charging capacity.

You could also hook the outback radian to a generator in case it's night, Your ev is drained and can't connect with to the grid.

With your EV, Solar, and generator, you become your own power company.


Keep in mind these are all theory's and don't recommend trying it. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:39 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:13 pm
Posts: 110
Location: Berkeley, CA
Could I suggest something simple? I'd like a simple break out box that would plug into my car, and I could plug in a few extension chords and run a few basic 110v circuits off of. It would let me have some basic emergency power in a blackout, or in the field (bbq, party, construction site) or while camping - Even limited to a minimal output, it could be amazingly useful. In fact, a very basic circuit in the back of my Rav that would easily let me plug in a battery charger to keep my drills charged, or to run a vacuum or similar would be great -


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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:58 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:13 pm
Posts: 1607
Location: Los Altos, CA
Tadol wrote:
Could I suggest something simple? I'd like a simple break out box that would plug into my car, and I could plug in a few extension chords and run a few basic 110v circuits off of. It would let me have some basic emergency power in a blackout, or in the field (bbq, party, construction site) or while camping - Even limited to a minimal output, it could be amazingly useful. In fact, a very basic circuit in the back of my Rav that would easily let me plug in a battery charger to keep my drills charged, or to run a vacuum or similar would be great -
If you only need 120V AC and less than 1,500 Watts, then you can easily get a 12V inverter to do what you want. You just need to connect into the 12V system where the wires are thick enough to support the load. It's those of us that want 5kW-10kW that would need something larger that would draw directly from the traction battery, likely through the CHAdeMO port. These devices exist, but only in Japan.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the Outback Power Skybox system so I can build a stationary storage system. If it is everything I imagine it will be, I will get an EV pack (or packs) from crashed EVs and set it up so that most of my house is basically on a giant UPS. Add some solar that directly charges the batteries and it will keep going for a long time if the grid goes down. Also, if the new solar is not enough, I can charge the batteries from the grid at off peak hours or in the mornings from my existing Enphase solar system. The key point is that I don't want the battery inverter to flow back to the grid.

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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:22 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3872
Location: San Diego
Use the 1000 or 1500 watt version so that you don't overload the 100 amp DC to DC:

Use 2 gauge wires to connect this DIRECTLY to the battery. When you use it, just put the car in READY, or you will very quickly kill the 12 volt battery:

http://www.xantrex.com/documents/Power- ... 0-5000.pdf


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 Post subject: Re: Powering the grid from your car
PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:14 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 7:54 am
Posts: 15
Learn about the new Outback Skybox at a Training my Company is hosting in San Diego 25h-27th and other battery and Solar related topics for installers.

http://aeesolar.com/aee-solar-dealer-conference/

let me know if you need passes.


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