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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 2:39 am 
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Posts: 48
[quote="TonyWilliams"]

None of those numbers are out of the realm of possibility. Battery degradation plays no role in your consumption rate. Going up a hill, having a headwind, having an exceptional air conditioning load, running the cabin heater at all, having tire(s) with low pressure, leaving a dog strapped to the roof, etc, can all affect consumption rate, and thus range. The two big killers of range are a COLD battery, running the cabin heater, and your actual speed. You can always increase range (and reduce consumption) by turning off the cabin heater and using the seat heaters, and slowing down.[/quote]


Thanks for the input Tony. Settings: Climate control off or ECO HI A/C, no heat; hills - yes; headwind - not sure; cold battery on at least one leg; dogs were both inside. So I guess my numbers were within range.




[quote="TonyWilliams"]

Did you reset the consumption meters (both pages of data, including "UPDATE"... three things to clear)?

Did you use the MAP MODE (lower left hand corner button on the MAP screen) to split the screen with MAP and ENERGY CONSUMPTION?[/quote]


All I did after each leg was EV > ENERGY MONITOR > UPDATE. What else should have cleared? What effect did not clearing those two have on this particular trip's data? I just went out and tried the split screen and will experiment with it on the next long trip. I didn't use it this time. The actual numbers I mentioned were in numerical order, not leg/driving order.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks again,
John


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3663
Location: San Diego
Yep, it sounds like you understand it. I like to make the actual consumption rate match what I planned to consume as follows:

If the next CHAdeMO station is 110 miles away, I want about 125 miles of range (10% - 20% extra). With a new battery at 70F battery temperature or above, I will need 3.4 miles per kWh with 37kWh onboard (about 90% of a new battery, or a fully charged battery that is 10% degraded) to have 125 miles of range.

You can get this data from the range chart:

viewtopic.php?p=251#p251


So, then I will look at the range chart and determine that I need 65mph on flat, no wind roads, without cabin heater to generate those 3.4 miles per kWh. But, I'm always going to start out below that speed to allow me to perhaps speed up at the end. It's a real drag to have to slow down at the end!!!

You always have to adjust for elevation from start to finish (1.5 to 1.8 kWh extra consumed per 1000 feet higher at destination than start, depending on vehicle weight). Therefore, driving from sea level Sacramento to nearly 7000 feet Lake Tahoe will consume an additional:

12kWh = 7 * 1.7kWh

That means with 37kWh onboard, we have to adjust:

25kWh effectively onboard = 37 kWh - 12 kWh


*****


So, to drive those 110 miles up a 7000 foot mountain requires:


4.4 miles per kWh = 110 miles / 25 kWh, or about 45-50mph up the hill, according to the range chart.


******


So, for my journey of 110 miles on a level highway, I will start out at 60mph. I will monitor the performance every 10-20 miles. I reset the energy consumption meters (both pages) and reset the trip odometer, and I'm off.

If, after 20 miles, I'm no where near 3.4 miles per kWh, it's time for some action. I'll slow to 55mph, and monitor in 20 more miles... did it start to trend upwards at all? If so, I'll stay at 55mph until reaching 3.4 miles per kWh. If the consumption is holding steady at the lower value consumption rate (below the planned 3.4 miles/kWh), or still trending downwards, I'll slow to 50mph (and start thinking about Plan B recharging spots).

This is why I won't normally plan to drive below 65mph, except in exceptional situations. If I'm within about 40 miles of the destination, I can start eating into my reserves by speeding up or turning on the cabin heater if I'm cold.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 3:43 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
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Location: San Diego
We are shipping a LOT more JdeMOs outside of California.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:03 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:13 pm
Posts: 1449
Location: Los Altos, CA
"We are shipping a LOT more JdeMOs outside of California."

That makes sense. As the cars come off lease, used car dealers outside California are buying them up at auction. Also, dealers like CarMax are transferring them out of the state.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:56 pm 
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Posts: 3663
Location: San Diego
I thought you gypuys might like to see what we are doing with the Tesla Roadster:



Image



Image



Image


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:53 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3663
Location: San Diego
miimura wrote:
Tony,

Do you plan to find the heat rejection limit and just set the max current there, or could you have the system charge faster to start and just reduce the current to stay under some temperature limit? In cold weather, like driving to Tahoe, it would be nice to be able to charge faster when the cooling system is more efficient.

Also, what is the rating on the Yazaki inlets that were installed? Are they rated for 200 amps? What about the HV cables between the inlet and the battery pack?


In order to upgrade the current 45kW / 125A JdeMO charge rate into the RAV4 to something higher, the following is required:

The relays are 800a rated, about 200a continuous. No change.

Cables to the battery are 2 gauge, which likely can handle short term 200a (I honestly don't know right now). These can "somewhat" easily be made larger.

Inlet cables to the relays are the metric equivalent of 2 gauge. These cannot be made larger, therefore the single weakest link with the JdeMO hardware is this link.

After extensive testing, we will set the maximum amps at whatever is logical for the weakest link.

The battery temperature part is somewhat easy. If it gets warm, we reduce power. Nothing will change, except the maximum amps, plus we will add either one or two lines to the temp table:

10C to 45C cell temperature = 125a max
15C to 44C cell temperature = 150a max
17C to 43C cell temperature = 200a max

In addition, we will likely explore ways to manually run the cooling pump and air conditioning compressor at 38C.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:06 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:00 pm
Posts: 85
Day saved yet again by the JdeMO!

I wanted to give Tony and Bob Williams a big shout out and thank you for saving my day again yesterday by creating the JdeMO. My blink charger died after 5.5 years and I went out to drive my car to a hiking trail 40 miles away expecting my Rav4 to be fully charged like normal. However, my car only had 10 miles of range. So I had to go to a few different quick chargers as the Whole Food near my house had 5 Leafs trying to charge on only 2 available Quick chargers. I went to Emeryville where I only had to wait 15 minutes for one of the chargers to open up and was able to Charge my Rav4. Basically if I did not have the JdeMO installed on my car, it would have ruined my plans for the day by having to wait 5 hours to charge on L2 before being able to proceed on my journey. With the JdeMo, I was only an hour and a half delayed mainly because the demand for quick chargers is greater than capacity and it took an hour to find an open quick charger.

The JdeMo makes the Rav4 EV a viable transportation option for me whereas the stock Rav4 EV would not meet my driving needs and would be terribly inconvenient du to the slow charging speed of the stock L2 max charging.

Thank you, thank you, and thank you for providing a solution to Toyotas shortcomings with the Rav4 EV!!!!

I'm interested to see about the extra batteries. How is that project proceeding and do you still anticipate providing this option? I am interested in buying extra battery capacity if the price point makes sense and if it rolls out before I am able to buy my M3.

For all of you that don't have the JdeMO, I have found it to be a lifesaver and a great option for road trips, as long as there are DC quick chargers in route.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 4:29 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:43 am
Posts: 230
Location: Redwood City, CA
[quote="TonyWilliams"]I thought you gypuys might like to see what we are doing with the Tesla Roadste[/quote]

Sweet!
I sent a message about this to a neighbor with a Roadster last summer. Looks like I should remind him again...


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 5:58 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3663
Location: San Diego
tgreene wrote:
TonyWilliams wrote:
I thought you gypuys might like to see what we are doing with the Tesla Roadste


Sweet!
I sent a message about this to a neighbor with a Roadster last summer. Looks like I should remind him again...


We have presold about 30 units for the Roadster worldwide (below what we presold for the RAV4), but an odd metric is that there is exactly one presold in the entire SF Bay Area. One.

In contrast, we have dozens of JdeMO - RAV4 customers throughout NorCal.


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 Post subject: Re: CHAdeMO for Rav4 EV "JdeMO" by Quick Charge Power
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 5:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3663
Location: San Diego
To all our current and future JdeMO customers, Toyota USA has just reached out to us to receive our documents related to performing warranty work on the RAV4 EV that is equipped with our JdeMO fast charging product.

They will disseminate this information through their regional offices for warranty repairs done by Toyota representatives.

This work is usually performed at non-EV certified Toyota dealers doing major repairs like a motor swap, or major electronic malfunction. I'm not sure if they also might show up for cabin heater or onboard charger swaps.

Even the EV qualified dealers have had a Toyota USA representative, so I'm not sure what the exact criteria is.


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