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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 8:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 3966
Location: San Diego
miimura wrote:
The bolded section is good. However, that language is governing the relationship between Toyota and Tesla. If Toyota doesn't feel like giving you a like-for-like replacement battery, as measured by MWh throughput or kWh capacity, they don't have to. The agreement between you and Toyota is governed by the Warranty Guide, not the Tesla contract.


My lawyer wife and I just went a few rounds with this... there's no chance you'll win this.

You have an agreement with Toyota, not Tesla. Toyota will provide "refurbished" parts. They can line up Tesla and Toyota engineers who will claim the Tony-Test is made up wishful thinking.

Then, they will demand "proof" that your claim of the previous battery being better, or which you won't have besides "hearsay".

The odds of finding another car that will pull over 140 miles with a Tony-Test is slim. But, I'm confident that you could find something over the 120's easily. Are all the sales taxes, license fees, etc, worth a few extra miles of range?


Last edited by TonyWilliams on Sat May 06, 2017 4:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:34 am
Posts: 42
All your points are good ones but my cost for Small Claims is minimal. I do actually have a few photos of Tony test results over 140 and plan to collect a few more.

The cost for Toyota (bringing in a team of engineers) and the risk of defeat in court, even as Small Claims is not a precedent court, will likely move them to settle.

My argument with the Toyota / Tesla contract will be:
- The T/T contract specifies a definition of refurbishment that one would have reasonable expectation was concluded to be passed to the consumer (judge has to decide this)
- The normal definition of "refurbished" is returned to functioning to spec as a new product....not a piece of junk

Anyone having Tony Test pics would be appreciated. They should include mileage and vin. Especially nice would be one conducted by Toyota services.

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Ford Focus EV 2013 - GONE
2008 Toyota Prius
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Pearl (lease takeover used to replace my old one) GONE - Toyota messed with my battery
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Shoreline Blue - Bought still in warranty with only 11,700 miles after 3 yrs


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 5:27 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:51 pm
Posts: 574
Even if you win a default judgement... good luck collecting. They do not just roll over and write a check.


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 6:26 am 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:34 am
Posts: 42
smkettner wrote:
Even if you win a default judgement... good luck collecting. They do not just roll over and write a check.


This is true...but on both sides there are risks. To Toyota there are many others who would see my success, possibly news coverage and more. Then the negotiations after a judgment to avoid appeal. My guess is that it won't got that far that a sober biz judgement will say "look what happened to United and their brand" and make a reasonable settlement. It is business and they will weigh risks... right now they have to know that it is one sided risk. $100 for Small Claims, no cost recovery if I lose.

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Ford Focus EV 2013 - GONE
2008 Toyota Prius
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Pearl (lease takeover used to replace my old one) GONE - Toyota messed with my battery
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Shoreline Blue - Bought still in warranty with only 11,700 miles after 3 yrs


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:01 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:45 am
Posts: 84
I wish you the best of luck

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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:29 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:34 am
Posts: 42
Update:
So, the replacement battery that Toyota installed was deficient in range with a Tony test of 126 (this is old history)

After much haranguing and verification by Tesla/Toyota that it WAS indeed deficient, they found my old battery which last tested at 141(cold day in March) and fixed the contactor.

They installed my old battery and initial testing shows it maxes at 135, not 141. (they reported to Toyota 126 since it was not extended charged.)

I am going to return the vehicle, now at end of lease and have acquired a 2014 Blue RAV4 EV with 11,780 miles! It is still in warranty and got the extended 8 year 100k mile warranty.

I got this beauty for $20.9k at Carlsbad Toyota to be delivered up north here Saturday.

The vehicle is IMMACULATE just like new. Battery tested to 143 :) I bet they left it full or empty a lot or it would have been at 146.

_________________
Ford Focus EV 2013 - GONE
2008 Toyota Prius
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Pearl (lease takeover used to replace my old one) GONE - Toyota messed with my battery
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Shoreline Blue - Bought still in warranty with only 11,700 miles after 3 yrs


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 4:46 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:07 pm
Posts: 46
Location: River Pines, CA
laguna_b wrote:
Update: After much haranguing and verification by Tesla/Toyota that it WAS indeed deficient, they found my old battery which last tested at 141(cold day in March) and fixed the contactor.

have acquired a 2014 Blue RAV4 EV with 11,780 miles! It is still in warranty and got the extended 8 year 100k mile warranty.

I got this beauty for $20.9k at Carlsbad Toyota to be delivered up north here Saturday.



Wow, sorry to hear all the back and forth. You'd think they'd test the replacement before install. Glad they found and refurbished your old battery. That Blue sounds perfect good luck with it.

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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:01 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:34 am
Posts: 42
co2112 wrote:
laguna_b wrote:
Update: After much haranguing and verification by Tesla/Toyota that it WAS indeed deficient, they found my old battery which last tested at 141(cold day in March) and fixed the contactor.

have acquired a 2014 Blue RAV4 EV with 11,780 miles! It is still in warranty and got the extended 8 year 100k mile warranty.

I got this beauty for $20.9k at Carlsbad Toyota to be delivered up north here Saturday.



Wow, sorry to hear all the back and forth. You'd think they'd test the replacement before install. Glad they found and refurbished your old battery. That Blue sounds perfect good luck with it.


I got the car up here a week ago. The motor is much quieter than my old ones. The car is immaculately clean, especially under the hood. You would SWEAR it was brand new, not 12k miles. It shows no sign of the wear and tear that I put on my old one living on mountain roads and pot holes. BEST of all..... "Tony test"ed out today at a full 146 miles range! 100% nominal battery!

If anyone is interested, there is a Silver (grey?) with 13k at SF Toyota for a good price. I have not seen it (hate grey).

_________________
Ford Focus EV 2013 - GONE
2008 Toyota Prius
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Pearl (lease takeover used to replace my old one) GONE - Toyota messed with my battery
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV - Shoreline Blue - Bought still in warranty with only 11,700 miles after 3 yrs


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:45 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 8:15 am
Posts: 243
So is the bottom line the warrantied batteries are used? not new?


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 Post subject: Re: ALL POSTS - Replacement Traction Battery
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:53 am 
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Joined: Mon May 19, 2014 4:49 am
Posts: 571
Location: Ithaca, NY
Dont forget to update the owners spreadsheet if you had anything replaced. This will help us see how big of an issue this is!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SRbGy1BE8i2XRuejbNURNkWLdIi0T5OGUJiksah6mQ0/edit?usp=sharing

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