Toyota Rav4 EV Forum

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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:23 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:26 pm
Posts: 39
Location: Brentwood, CA
Fremont Toyota has a used 2012 Rav4 Ev with only 400 miles sitting on the showroom floor gathering dust. Asking price $42,370?! They call it a rollback. The car was sold...then returned when the financing fell through. It's kind of sad...the car is stuck in limbo. Considered "used" by the state...so rebates can't be claimed. Special 0% financing doesn't apply, becaused it's "used". The dealership won't budge on the price on the slight chance some stupid sucker will come along and pay $42K.

The worst thing is the condition of the car. When the salesman tried to turn the car on...nothing :( The battery has been "Bricked"!

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2014 Rav4 EV Quicksilver #3532
2014 Honda Fit Ev
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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:48 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:13 pm
Posts: 1766
Location: Los Altos, CA
Hoosier wrote:
The worst thing is the condition of the car. When the salesman tried to turn the car on...nothing :( The battery has been "Bricked"!
Meh. No biggie. The 12V battery is just dead. A jump start and some time at READY and it will be fine. They just need to power it up to READY for 30 minutes or so every week. They should know better. Many dealers found out the hard way that even leaving cars on a charging station did not maintain the 12V battery.

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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 3:20 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:05 am
Posts: 311
miimura wrote:
They should know better. Many dealers found out the hard way that even leaving cars on a charging station did not maintain the 12V battery.

Yeah mine was dead when the salesman went to take it to detailing after sitting on the lot for 3 or more weeks. They jumped it with a portable 12v battery and it started right up. The dealerships need to realize the phantom drain these cars have will kill the 12v battery every time. So many dealerships are clueless!

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 Post subject: Re: Engine/Power Steering turned off in middle of the freewa
PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 2:06 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:21 pm
Posts: 51
Location: Oakland, CA
miimura wrote:
Ntd wrote:
Actually, 4-- two days after our failure on the freeway, another forum member had the same happen while driving on El Camino-- also a car from Magnussen's, with about 750 miles on it. Like ours, the Tesla power system was found to be faulty and was replaced (our original also had a bad Gateway ECU).

The incident in Washington was earlier. These most recent 3 all involved 2013 model year vehicles leased within the last 2 months.

This is really unacceptable...
...and then there were 5. Another car mentioned in this thread purchased from Stevens Creek Toyota died under power at 2,552 odometer miles.


Has anyone heard of problems with VIN # 2T3YL4DV4CW001031? I am going to look at it today. White 2012 with about 5700 miles for sale by SF Dealer. The VIN # has 7 events per vin check on edmunds.com.

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#1694
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 Post subject: Re: Engine/Power Steering turned off in middle of the freewa
PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 4052
Location: San Diego
longrangeview wrote:
Has anyone heard of problems with VIN # 2T3YL4DV4CW001031? I am going to look at it today. White 2012 with about 5700 miles for sale by SF Dealer. The VIN # has 7 events per vin check on edmunds.com.


This could have been a dealer demo/loaner vehicle. Of the first 61 sold when the car was released on 9/24/2012, most were sold to the dealers. It looks like this was one such vehicle, probably from Sept 24, 2012 until April 9, 2013, when it was offered for sale.

This one is production serial number 31. The 1000 is added to the serial number for some unknown reason.

If you're interested in what was repaired, you'll have to get that from the dealer.


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
05/28/2012 NICB Vehicle manufactured
and shipped to original dealer

09/24/2012 10 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Pre-delivery inspection completed

09/24/2012 San Francisco Toyota
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8300
sftoyota.com Vehicle offered for sale

10/01/2012 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Dealer took title of this vehicle
while it was in inventory
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported

04/09/2013 Dealer Inventory
San Francisco, CA Vehicle offered for sale

06/10/2013 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Correction to record
Loan or lien reported

07/17/2013 5,713 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Vehicle offered for sale

07/26/2013 5,748 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Washed/detailed

08/02/2013 Dealer Inventory Vehicle offered for sale

_________________
Tony Williams
QC Charge
1780-104 La Costa Meadows Drive
San Marcos, California 92078 USA
tony@QCcharge.com
www.QCcharge.com
Twitter: QCPower
1-844-EV-PARTS
1-844-387-2787
1-760-798-0342 Office
Hours M-F, 9-5 Pacific Time


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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:47 pm
Posts: 13
Location: San Fernando Valley
TonyWilliams wrote:
longrangeview wrote:
Has anyone heard of problems with VIN # 2T3YL4DV4CW001031? I am going to look at it today. White 2012 with about 5700 miles for sale by SF Dealer. The VIN # has 7 events per vin check on edmunds.com.

<snip>
10/01/2012 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Dealer took title of this vehicle
while it was in inventory
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported
</snip>

It looks like it is not eligible for the federal tax credit or CVRP rebate, or any Toyota incentives on new RAV4EVs. Assuming that's true, be sure you take that into consideration when negotiating price. EV salespeople are notoriously bad at giving out the wrong information for stuff like this. Dianne on the forum here an exception to that.

Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 5:16 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:50 pm
Posts: 4052
Location: San Diego
mikeEmike wrote:
It looks like it is not eligible for the federal tax credit or CVRP rebate, or any Toyota incentives on new RAV4EVs. Assuming that's true, be sure you take that into consideration when negotiating price. EV salespeople are notoriously bad at giving out the wrong information for stuff like this. Dianne on the forum here an exception to that.

Good luck!


Yep. Dealers / salespeople will generally tell you whatever you want to hear to make the sale.

*****************************

Unprepared Buyer, "Will this car qualify for the $7500 / $2500 tax incentives?"

Unscrupulous Seller, "I'm sure it will, why not?"

UB, "But doesn't the car need to be new?"

US, "Oh, I wouldn't worry about that now. You have to apply for that after the sale. Just sign here and I'll help you figure it out later."

UB, "Well, there's a guy on the internet who spends a lot of his time warning people of dealers like you. I don't think I'm comfortable buying this car without knowing for sure if I get the tax incentives."

US, "Ya, that guy... we know him... I think he used to work here as a salesman and we had to fire him because of all the bad "advice" he was giving people. I would never lie to you like "that guy" does, so just go ahead and sign here, mmmm, k?"

UB, "Oh, thank you for looking out for me. I'll take the $2000 extended warranty and $1200 water pump / muffler bearing insurance, plus the $3900 paint sealant, fabric protection, and car alarm package. Heck, since I'm getting a total of $10,000 in tax incentives, I can even afford the $2900 radio with 8-track tape option. You're such a good salesman."

US, "Yes, I am."

One month later:

UB, "You lied to me... used cars don't qualify for any of the tax incentives. I want my money back."

US, "We can't do that, since California law has no "cooling off" period for car sales, but we can give you lifetime free oil changes for your car."

UB, "You idiot, my car doesn't use oil."

US, "I'm pretty sure it does. It's right next to the muffler bearing. You bought the insurance to cover the muffler bearing, remember?"

UB, "I'm going to sue!"

US, "Sure you will... like everybody else! No matter what, I'll still have made my commission, the weekend sales "spiff" and plus I earned a trip to Fiji thanks to your car sale. Gotta go pack, I'm leaving in the morning, bye!"

UB, "You bastard."

SIX MONTHS LATER:

Court Bailiff, "All rise, the Honorable Judge Kermit I. Frog presiding."

Kermit, "I find for the dealership, who gave me this beautiful new car with lifetime oil changes. Wow, what a car!!!"

Court Bailiff, "Uh, judge, I think you're supposed to actually make it look like you carefully considered all the plaintiff's arguments prior to issuing your predetermined verdict."

Kermit, "Sorry, uh, Mr. Unsuspecting Buyer, if that is your real name, why have you wasted the court's time with your frivolous claim?"

UB, "The dealer told me I could get $10,000 in tax incentives if I bought this car."

US, "No I didn't, your honor. Like we discussed in your private chamber earlier, where we delivered your new car, I only told Mr. Buyer that I would look into it. What idiot buys a car based on what a salesman says?"

Kermit, "I've heard enough. I hereby sentence Mr. Buyer to 3 years hard labor in San Quentin State Prison."

Court Bailiff, "Uh, judge, this is civil court, not criminal."

Kermit, "Ok, then, I find that Mr. Buyer is an idiot and is hereby ordered to pay all his lawyer's fees, plus all the court costs, plus the car dealership lawyer's fees, plus a beautiful new diamond necklace for Miss Piggy."

Court Bailiff, "All rise, court adjourned."

_________________
Tony Williams
QC Charge
1780-104 La Costa Meadows Drive
San Marcos, California 92078 USA
tony@QCcharge.com
www.QCcharge.com
Twitter: QCPower
1-844-EV-PARTS
1-844-387-2787
1-760-798-0342 Office
Hours M-F, 9-5 Pacific Time


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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:09 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:21 pm
Posts: 51
Location: Oakland, CA
TonyWilliams wrote:
mikeEmike wrote:
It looks like it is not eligible for the federal tax credit or CVRP rebate, or any Toyota incentives on new RAV4EVs. Assuming that's true, be sure you take that into consideration when negotiating price. EV salespeople are notoriously bad at giving out the wrong information for stuff like this. Dianne on the forum here an exception to that.

Good luck!


Yep. Dealers / salespeople will generally tell you whatever you want to hear to make the sale.

*****************************

Unprepared Buyer, "Will this car qualify for the $7500 / $2500 tax incentives?"

Unscrupulous Seller, "I'm sure it will, why not?"



Truly, I am laughing out loud.

OK. Got it. Clear view of what NOT to do.

The drama got postponed. The dealer did not make the vehicle available today. Next Tuesday is the day the dealer agreed to get the car to my mechanic. The car is used. Lemon law does not apply. The sale would be "accepted as is...". I need to know if the ECU, transmission, propulsion system and other parts were repaired or need repair.

The dealer wants $39K before taxes, license and registration fees. I am negotiating for $29K to $33K after taxes and $10K State and Federal Incentives. I am hoping we can reach a happy medium.

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EV Rav4 2013 Blizzard Pearl
6.5 kW solar panels since 2002
#1694
Leviton 40A EVSE


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 Post subject: Re: Pre-Owned Rav4 EV for sale, POST HERE ONLY
PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:14 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:21 pm
Posts: 51
Location: Oakland, CA
mikeEmike wrote:
TonyWilliams wrote:
longrangeview wrote:
Has anyone heard of problems with VIN # 2T3YL4DV4CW001031? I am going to look at it today. White 2012 with about 5700 miles for sale by SF Dealer. The VIN # has 7 events per vin check on edmunds.com.

<snip>
10/01/2012 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Dealer took title of this vehicle
while it was in inventory
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported
</snip>

It looks like it is not eligible for the federal tax credit or CVRP rebate, or any Toyota incentives on new RAV4EVs. Assuming that's true, be sure you take that into consideration when negotiating price. EV salespeople are notoriously bad at giving out the wrong information for stuff like this.

Dianne on the forum here an exception to that.

Good luck!



Thank you! I will need it.

_________________
EV Rav4 2013 Blizzard Pearl
6.5 kW solar panels since 2002
#1694
Leviton 40A EVSE


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Engine/Power Steering turned off in middle of the freewa
PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 5:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:21 pm
Posts: 51
Location: Oakland, CA
TonyWilliams wrote:
longrangeview wrote:
Has anyone heard of problems with VIN # 2T3YL4DV4CW001031? I am going to look at it today. White 2012 with about 5700 miles for sale by SF Dealer. The VIN # has 7 events per vin check on edmunds.com.


This could have been a dealer demo/loaner vehicle. Of the first 61 sold when the car was released on 9/24/2012, most were sold to the dealers. It looks like this was one such vehicle, probably from Sept 24, 2012 until April 9, 2013, when it was offered for sale.

This one is production serial number 31. The 1000 is added to the serial number for some unknown reason.

If you're interested in what was repaired, you'll have to get that from the dealer.


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
05/28/2012 NICB Vehicle manufactured
and shipped to original dealer

09/24/2012 10 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Pre-delivery inspection completed

09/24/2012 San Francisco Toyota
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8300
sftoyota.com Vehicle offered for sale

10/01/2012 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Dealer took title of this vehicle
while it was in inventory
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported

04/09/2013 Dealer Inventory
San Francisco, CA Vehicle offered for sale

06/10/2013 California
Motor Vehicle Dept.
San Francisco, CA Title issued or updated
Correction to record
Loan or lien reported

07/17/2013 5,713 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Vehicle offered for sale

07/26/2013 5,748 San Francisco Toyota & Van Ness
San Francisco, CA
415-750-8310
sftoyota.com Washed/detailed

08/02/2013 Dealer Inventory Vehicle offered for sale



Thank you for that very interesting information!

_________________
EV Rav4 2013 Blizzard Pearl
6.5 kW solar panels since 2002
#1694
Leviton 40A EVSE


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