ALL POSTS about Charge Timer Failure

[Kohler Controller]

Questions: what is the noise during charging? Anyone knows where does it come from?

I don't know for sure, but I would suspect it's one of the liquid cooling pumps & fans, either for the batteries, charger, motor/controller, or a combination of any of the above.

On a side note, my RAV4EV has skipped programmed overnight charging twice in a row. Both times I charged at work using 120V EVSE prior to coming home and plugging into my standard 240VAC EVSE. It still clicks and turns on the yellow lights as though it is in the holding pattern (as described in the manual), but doesn't actually charge. So it could either be some memory associated with the 120V vs 240V charging history as one on this list has suggested, or could be something related to the AeroVironment EVSE signature vs. the Panasonic EVSE signature (if there is such a thing).

I'll have to do some more testing. I need to set up a design of experiments in which I can scientifically tests these theories. SeaMonster, I'd love to include your detailed situational observations so that I can capture the right inputs.

 

[waidy]

Questions: what is the noise during charging? Anyone knows where does it come from?

Pumps for the coolant in the battery and charger. Does the Tesla Model S make the same noises?

The LEAF, and your first generation Rav4 EV, did not have battery and charger liquid cooling.

My Model S doesn't give me the continuous noise. Model S's charging noise only happen occasionally during charging (starts and stops, starts and stops..). In additions, my model S's noise is not as loud in compare to the 2012 Rav4EV.

My 2002 Rav4EV is "fan cool" so it has continuous fan noise during charging.

Thanks for your clarification on the 2012 Rav4EV charging noise.

 

[SeaMonster]

On a side note, my RAV4EV has skipped programmed overnight charging twice in a row. Both times I charged at work using 120V EVSE prior to coming home and plugging into my standard 240VAC EVSE. It still clicks and turns on the yellow lights as though it is in the holding pattern (as described in the manual), but doesn't actually charge. So it could either be some memory associated with the 120V vs 240V charging history as one on this list has suggested, or could be something related to the AeroVironment EVSE signature vs. the Panasonic EVSE signature (if there is such a thing).

I'll have to do some more testing. I need to set up a design of experiments in which I can scientifically tests these theories. SeaMonster, I'd love to include your detailed situational observations so that I can capture the right inputs.

Kohler,

I can confirm that there is an almost 100% chance that a scheduled 240 charge will fail after doing a manual 120 charge. And Toyota is aware of that. See my post on Mar 22 in this thread (page 7 of 19 for me). But I have had some scheduled charges succeed after a 120 manual charge and I don't know why. I also have many failed charges that are not related to 120 charges.

For my data collection, I mostly use the Entune email messages to record charge start/stop/interrupt in an excel. spreadsheet. I also have recorded other observations based on theories of a cause that I interest in. I record if I enter the car after plugging in. I enter if I use the entune app after plugging in and if I do an "update" with the app. (Doing an update while the car is sleeping seems to often kebash the scheduled charge.) I'm happy to provide my spreadsheet to anyone that wants it. Just PM me an email address. In there you can see older theories that I no longer follow and when the recording device was in my car, I recorded a lot of extra data that I no longer keep on a regular basis.

On another note: i received notice yesterday that my Lemon Law case is valid and a hearing is being scheduled. Valid doesn't mean the car is a Lemon, but that my claim meets the basic requirements for having a hearing.

 

[Dsinned]

I take no pleasure in saying this, but if SeaMonster's Lemon Law case goes to litigation, thus setting a legal precedent in favor of consumers, I think Toyota may FINALLY "wake up" and take this scheduled charging issue far more seriously!

SeaMonster, please keep us informed as things continue to progress.

 

[TonyWilliams]

On a side note, my RAV4EV has skipped programmed overnight charging twice in a row. Both times I charged at work using 120V EVSE prior to coming home and plugging into my standard 240VAC EVSE. It still clicks and turns on the yellow lights as though it is in the holding pattern (as described in the manual), but doesn't actually charge.

There's a hard data point that we should all be able to prove/disprove.

I no longer have the 120v EVSE, so I'd have to find somebody else with one. Maybe a stop at the dealer.

 

[TeCKis300]

I can confirm that there is an almost 100% chance that a scheduled 240 charge will fail after doing a manual 120 charge. And Toyota is aware of that. See my post on Mar 22 in this thread (page 7 of 19 for me). But I have had some scheduled charges succeed after a 120 manual charge and I don't know why. I also have many failed charges that are not related to 120 charges.

I had a string of charge timer failures last week and this was the likely culprit! I had borrowed my wife's RAV for work one day and I have 120V charging outlets at work that I used. This caused the nightly scheduled charge at home to fail and not leave enough charge for her to drive the next morning. So I took the car again...repeating the pattern and causing it again. And again.

It wasn't until I completely reset the car by pulling the 12V battery, that it was able to succeed on a charge timer again. Quite frustrating, but now I know why.

This is definitely going to be a problem for me if I am to ever use the RAV.

My wife had mentioned these intermittent issues to her service adviser at the 5k checkup and they were completely ignorant of the issue and potential available firmware updates.

 

[miimura]

You should try an Immediate Charge for a few minutes on 240V, then interrupt it by unplugging. Open the driver's door to see what it says, then plug it in again for the timed charge.

 

[fooljoe]

I no longer have the 120v EVSE, so I'd have to find somebody else with one. Maybe a stop at the dealer.

You got rid of your Toyota EVSE and your Nissan one? Why not try the Nissan one on 120v if you still have it - I doubt it would make any difference, but it might be interesting to see whether a different brand of EVSE makes any difference with the timer issue?

 

[rickrodod]

Thanks for posting the charge timer failure issue.
I think I will just use the charge immediately when plugged in option for now.

 

[Sport Mode]

I have an update regarding the Charge Timer Problems.

My Dealer updated the software on my car today telling me that this would fix the problems I have been having.
It took about 15 minutes to install. They stuck a USB drive with the update in the USB port and went to
the setting menu to do a Software Update.

I will be testing it over the next week to see if I still get the Charging Interruption Messages. (that I have been getting almost every night)

I was told that Toyota will be issuing a TSB (Toyota Service Bulletin) soon (2-4 weeks?) regarding this Software Update.


Moderator edit: link to picture

http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/6053/img3696e.jpg

 

[Dsinned]

I could be mistaken, but from the looks of your software update screen, your may have only rec'd an update affecting Nav/Bluetooth functionality, but nothing to do with the charging system.

Last weekend I rec'd an update as well, but specifically for the charging system. Long story short, it did not fix anything. :x

From all that I have learned over the past 6 months, Toyota still has NOT come up with a effective firmware update that actually corrects the RAV4 EV's scheduled charging problem, including any and all related issues. :roll:

 

[Sport Mode]

Based on the display it would appear like it was just a Nav and Bluetooth update.

But, according to the Toyota Service Manager, Toyota was aware of the problem
and that they have been testing this fix for the past 2-3 weeks. He said I was
the first to get it before they issue the Service Bulletin.


We shall see. I have been having so many charging problems it should be easy to see if I
can tell a difference.

As of now, my car is supposed to start charging at 1:10 AM and finish at 5:40 AM.
I have 14 miles on my range meter.

 

[Dsinned]

I'll remain optimistic for your sake (and mine and everyone else). Please keep us posted and I hope this one will be a "winner"! :mrgreen:

Btw, if you don't mind, can you tell us who is your dealer? If this update turns out to be successful, I'm sure a LOT of other owners will be interested in finding out which dealers can install the same update as yours.

 

[fooljoe]

My experience with a 240V 16A EVSE is that it assumes the EVSE is 120V based on the current. It might be the same with a 20A EVSE. Plug in the EVSE right after you turn the car off and look at the screen. On mine when I used the 16A EVSE, the 220V estimated charge time disappeared only leaving the 120V estimated charge time.

I did some testing and now have evidence supporting the theory that the Rav4 assumes you're plugged in to 120v if it reads a 20a or lesser pilot signal. I set a departure time of 7 am Sunday, and, quickly after powering the car off, plugged in my 240v EVSE set to 20a. Here's what the display showed:

That says it plans to start charging at the ridiculously early 5:18 pm Saturday, if it's too blurry for you. I then unplugged, adjusted my EVSE to 21a, power-cycled the Rav, and tried again:

Now we have a much more reasonable 12:17 am starting time, from a tiny little 1 amp difference in the pilot signal. I then set a departure time for Saturday morning and left it plugged in, so we'll see if it'll actually do what the screen says it'll do.

A couple other things to note:

I set the departure time to 7 am even though I want charges to complete before 6 am - this seems to work pretty well on my CS-60, but I might need to make it even later for my 21a EVSE.

I've noticed failed charges have occurred in the past with the following scenario: I plug into my 20a EVSE at ~7pm, and the Rav assumes it's plugged in to 120v so starts charging immediately. I then unplug to stop the early charge, and possibly fiddle with the timer, then plug it back in. The Rav then blinks the yellow lights like it's supposed to but doesn't ever start the overnight charge. It thinks that it's "done for the day" because of its 30 second charge that I manually stopped. I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is related to the charge failures after 120v charging that others have seen.

I believe you can tell in advance that this will happen, however, if you look at the dash after plugging in. If the display shows a start time, as above, you should be good; but if it shows "--:--" where the start time should be then it won't charge. I found that to get the timer "reset" for the day you need to turn the car on, go into the timer setup, delete the day's departure time, save the changes, then go back and add the day's departure time back in before turning the car off and plugging in again. There might've been a power cycle of the car in the middle there too...

Anyway, long story short, if you have a <=20a EVSE, just give up on the timer unless Toyota/Tesla get their act together and update the software to have the car sample the voltage, but if 21a or greater, it should work, just set the departure time about an hour or so later than you really want to make up for the Rav apparently assuming 200-208V instead of 240V. And if you charge on 120v or manually terminate a charge the Rav started at some point in the day, delete then add back in your next departure time.

 

[TonyWilliams]

Awesome work!!!

It sure is great having that adjustable pilot signal, eh?

Not sure if it's in the thread, but the max the Tesla charger will handle 120 volts is at 20 amps.

 

[yblaser]

Thanks for documenting that, fooljoe. You'll also notice if you look at the screen to the right of the speedometer it has 120V and 240V charge durations and when you plug in the 20A EVSE the 240V will disappear showing only the 120V charge duration.

I still don't think the charge duration estimation error for EVSEs >20A is a result of an incorrect voltage assumption since it would need to be assuming ~155V to account for the error I observe. While I guess it could be assuming that, it would just be a very strange assumption.

If you have the ability to adjust the current of you EVSE, doing timed charges at various currents and measuring the total charge time vs how early it finishes would be interesting. Based on my experience I'm going to guess it is going to be around 65% for any current above 20A.

 

[dark]

Hi All,

I am new here, bought my 2012 Rav4 EV about a month ago, when I got my level 2 charger installed I used the departure schedule function and it failed 2 times out of 3.

It seems that the discussion stopped in March of 2013. Does anyone have any fix situation?

I stopped by 2 dealers and no one has a clue of what they are doing, so I called Toyota Care and they advised me there is a TSB 0050-13 software update fix for this.

so, I dropped off my car at the dealer and asked them to perform the TSB 0050-13, and after waiting for an hour, they said I have to leave my car there for an entire day so they can trouble shoot. I was like, what? You can't just update my software, I was like, forget it, I took my car home.

Did any of you got this TSB 0050-13 software update? If so, did it fix the timer failure problem? And how did you ask the dealer to perform the update without leaving your car there the entire day?

 

[Dsinned]

Welcome Dark and Congrats on your new RAV4 EV.

Here is a thread I started 9 days ago. It is about an unsuccessful firmware update to "improve" battery charging (whatever that means?) applied to my car. I was told the dealer could not verify the fix, so I took my car home the same day. I've heard of a few other forum members here getting a similar (or likely the same) update since March, all unsuccessful as well.

http://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=371

I have since been in communication with my dealer's Customer Relations person to report and complain that the update did nothing constructive whatsoever. I was asked (AGAIN) for more detailed information as to the nature of the problem. I provided that and more, a link to this forum's related threads. I was told they would forward all the information on to Toyota and wait for an "official" response (AGAIN).

There has been absolutely no progress in resolving this problem since the first customer complaints as far back as last November. Is this any way to run a car company???

 

[dark]

Welcome Dark and Congrats on your new RAV4 EV.

Here is a thread I started 9 days ago. It is about an unsuccessful firmware update to "improve" battery charging (whatever that means?) applied to my car. I was told the dealer could not verify the fix, so I took my car home the same day. I've heard of a few other forum members here getting a similar (or likely the same) update since March, all unsuccessful as well.

http://www.myrav4ev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=371

I have since been in communication with my dealer's Customer Relations person to report and complain that the update did nothing constructive whatsoever. I was asked (AGAIN) for more detailed information as to the nature of the problem. I provided that and more, a link to this forum's related threads. I was told they would forward all the information on to Toyota and wait for an "official" response (AGAIN).

There has been absolutely no progress in resolving this problem since the first customer complaints as far back as last November. Is this any way to run a car company???

Hi Dsinned,
Thanks for the info, I see that at least your car charges the traction battery. Mine doesn't charge at all, I didn't have any range to go to work the morning.
Also, when you took it in for the 5000 miles service, did you have to request for the firmware update? Or they performed on all Rav4 EV?
thanks,

 

[Dsinned]

Actually, I took my RAV4 EV in for a "six month" service at only about 2200 miles. At drop off, I inquired about any available firmware updates and the Ass't Service Mgr said they will do any outstanding automatically. When I picked up the car several hours later, I was told by that same ASM that they did in fact do one update related to battery charging, but they did not know what particular issues were addressed, and did NOT do anything to verify "scheduled charging" worked properly other than a quick manual charge initiation check with their own Leviton L2 EVSE. Later, that night I performed a scheduled charge at home and of course, there was absolutely no change in the abnormal behavior as already posted earlier in this thread.

As has been stated here many, many times before, unfortunately, Toyota really appears to be totally clueless on how to fix this problem!