talk me out of/convince me

[Pennsylvania RAV]

I'm one of the out of state gamblers. Only had the car 8 months, and 7,000 miles, but so far...zero issues.
Also have 2012 Leaf and ICE cars. As others have said, the much larger range/battery of RAV 4 EV over
LEAF is Key. It's not that you can go so much further. It's that you don't have to think about it. In my
experience reported ranges of LEAF (even on this and other sites) are very optimistic and official range
reports on RAV 4 are underestimates. My wife drives RAV and I drive LEAF. In winter, I watch the battery
level all the time and it's only a 35 mile commute round trip. I drive fast and in winter the LEAF battery
does not perform. I routinely forgo all heat except heater seat in LEAF. My wife drives RAV. She drives
kids around, errands, etc. She seldom goes more than 60 or 70 miles. I don't think she even knows where
the battery level gauge is (just kidding). But seriously, she never looks at it. You don't have to.

I took it in to my local PA non-prius plug in dealer at 5,000 miles for service. I didn't call to ask first. I
scheduled an appointment and took it in. They balked a tad at first...said they had to call some regional manager,
then agreed to honor the warranty and did the scheduled service. That said, if I need a major battery replacement
or powertrain work, they said we'd address that if it came up...who knows what that means. I've been a loyal customer
of this dealer and they have received a good chunk of change from me over the years. If I need major work I don't
what will happen, but for now they have agreed to do all scheduled maintenance work.

I bought the car and since I've been lucky so far, obviously I'll say that I'd do it again. Is this car as reliable as
buying a new Camry? Based on this site, obviously not. That's not the point.

The questions are these: Can you afford a Tesla or are you willing to spend money for one? What will rapidly degrading
battery capacity on the Leaf mean for you? How bad do you want to support the EV industry? I believe our country is
falling a part and is headed for a 2nd world country in no small part because of petroleum. So this is like a charitable
contribution to Tesla for me if the car fails. I'm okay with that. If you aren't willing to be different, take some chances,
go to some extra effort to have the type of transportation that we have all come to expect (and also a type of transportation
that is entirely unprecedented in the history of the human species and quite possibly unsustainable in the future) then do
not buy or lease this car.

If you are willing to take a risk and want to support what the EV movement means to many people (and if the Tesla and LEAF
just don't "fit" for above reasons), Buy a RAV.

 

[TonyWilliams]

If you are willing to take a risk and want to support what the EV movement means to many people (and if the Tesla and LEAF
just don't "fit" for above reasons), Buy a RAV.

Some would argue that buying the Rav4 EV from a company that is hostile toward EVs is not supporting the EV movement.

If you want to support companies that actually do support the EV movement, buy a Mitsubishi, Tesla or a LEAF.

 

[cossie1600]

Ha nissan likes building and selling cars, but you won't get much more customer service from them either. You have a rattle? They will tell you to suck it up

 

[mikegerard]

It's a great car. I'm one of those crazy out of state guys. I'll let you know if I have any problems but so far it's been great.

As far as Toyota not liking electric cars.... They are a business and they are losing money on the ev. They are probably just barely paying for tesla 's components. No one bought them at 50k.

Toyota is very conservative... Look at the prius. Using essentially the same batteries for a decade. Conservative is baked into the Toyota operating system (tos) that many companies try to copy... Part of that philosophy is not to change something with a low defect rate unless there is a much better alternative .

The rav 4 is more like a beta test to them.

 

[fooljoe]

To understand Toyota's stance on EVs you have to go back to the days of the first Rav4-EV. Back then, Toyota was actually the good guy: They were the only EV maker who actually sold some of their cars outright and didn't just reclaim and crush all the lease returns like the EV-1. And they worked with Panasonic to create the EV-95 NiMH battery, by far the best EV battery ever seen at the time (GM was still using lead-acid for the EV-1), and arguably better than today's lithium batteries as well, at least in terms of durability. Amazingly, a lot of those old Rav4-EVs are still on the road with original batteries, and they still get better range than the Leaf!

But Toyota paid a big price for being relatively progressive on EVs. Chevron had acquired control over a patent on NiMH batteries, and they brought a suit against Toyota and Panasonic demanding they cease production of the EV-95 and pay a large settlement. Toyota learned the hard way that supporting EVs was an uphill battle against powerful interests, so they gave up the fight and focused on the Prius instead. After getting burned like that in round 1, it's no surprise they're going to be very reluctant to get back in the EV game any more than they have to this time around.

Anyway, I'd say buying the Rav4-EV now is still supporting the EV movement, despite Toyota's current stance on EVs. Remember that Tesla's the only one making any money on these cars: Toyota paid Tesla $40k/car, more than I paid Toyota for it! Plus, if nothing less I respect the homage to the old Rav4-EV.

 

[evie]

First of all, thanks so much to everyone who responded. This forum is a fantastic source for real information.
So far it seems like there were more positive responses than negative.
The lease deal got a little more expensive this month, so I'll wait to see what the incentives are in November. But I'm definitely leaning towards getting one.
Maybe I'll be back on here soon as an actual owner (or lessee anyway).

 

[TonyWilliams]

The lease deal got a little more expensive this month, so I'll wait to see what the incentives are in November. But I'm definitely leaning towards getting one.
Maybe I'll be back on here soon as an actual owner (or lessee anyway).

Just to be clear, I'm neither recommending nor not recommending the car. Again, only you can know if the potential issues are worthwhile. The forum is full of all the issues.

As to better deals in November, that is very unlikely, as they will likely be selling 2014 model year cars then and will want near full price for at least a month or two before blowing them out for the end of the run this spring 2014.

Obviously, don't wait very long past spring if you want a new Rav4 EV on a lease!! That will be the end of the run.

 

[miimura]

I agree with Tony. The deals in November will only be any good on 2013's so they can clear them out. I don't expect to see the promotional deal on 2014's as good as today until January or February. This is what they did 6 months ago when the cut over from 2012 to 2013.

 

[cossie1600]

I think they will probably keep it for another month, it's still the same quarter. I doubt they will drop it back either

 

[shade]

Hi Evie,

Lots of good stuff here. I'll just add that I have had the car four months now and love it. As others have said, it's fun to drive, has great range, and the kids love it. We've used it as the daily driver, as well as on local camping trips.

It's great.

 

[Dianne]

Whether they continue it into Nov or Dec on the 2013's is not anything to do with quarters or timing. It's more like "what's left" and why would they incentivize a 14 with 13's still around? There are a few 13's still lingering at the plant, and I am certain it's because they want them to leave the plant perfect and free from any possible mechanical issues later.
Toyota's well known for Kaizen.
We improve continually.

As for the 14's, they just started arriving about 2 weeks ago to me. And, we have all year to sell them, frankly... so there's no hurry there. The focus will be on the 13's.