Buying Clipper Creek CS-60 as a group

[yblaser]

Thanks Mike. No I'm not having it inspected, so I don't have to do things by the book. I did install a 60A breaker so I want to make sure the wire can handle 60A. I guess I could switch the breaker out to 50A to make myself feel better. For my own edification I want to understand why people are recommending #4 when all the tables say #6 should be fine. Is this a another 125% rule where you want the breaker 125% of the expected current and the the wiring to handle 125% of the breaker current? BTW it is a 25 ft run to the sub panel so there should be no issues with voltage drop.

 

[AvLegends]

Thanks Mike. No I'm not having it inspected, so I don't have to do things by the book. I did install a 60A breaker so I want to make sure the wire can handle 60A. I guess I could switch the breaker out to 50A to make myself feel better. For my own edification I want to understand why people are recommending #4 when all the tables say #6 should be fine. Is this a another 125% rule where you want the breaker 125% of the expected current and the the wiring to handle 125% of the breaker current? BTW it is a 25 ft run to the sub panel so there should be no issues with voltage drop.

Without knowing the specifics of your install I would ask an electrician as to what is code for your area. I would want things to be properly sized as to the breaker and wire used. Looks like #8THHN is good for 55A from the chart below. Talked to my electrician and he said the #8 is for THHN only. Otherwise it would be #6. THHN has finer strands and allows for a higher rating.

 

[khaliss]

If you buy the cs-60 from ebay, can you Still claim the 30% fed Tax incentive And having a private electrician do the install?

 

[fooljoe]

Thanks Mike. No I'm not having it inspected, so I don't have to do things by the book. I did install a 60A breaker so I want to make sure the wire can handle 60A. I guess I could switch the breaker out to 50A to make myself feel better. For my own edification I want to understand why people are recommending #4 when all the tables say #6 should be fine. Is this a another 125% rule where you want the breaker 125% of the expected current and the the wiring to handle 125% of the breaker current? BTW it is a 25 ft run to the sub panel so there should be no issues with voltage drop.

Yes, it's something like the 125% rule. The tables cited here don't necessarily apply to a continuous load like charging an EV. One thing to note about that table is it says #14 wire is good for 20 amps, but I know for a fact you need #12 wire for a 20 amp circuit. Even if you're not having it inspected, I'd want to make sure everything's up to code just in case something (fire) happens. And after seeing what happened with Tony's Blink/Rav4 combo it's not like a fire is an impossibility; even if something else was actually at fault I wouldn't want to give your insurance company any reason to deny your claim.

I'm not sure what the code is for the wire size for a 60 amp circuit, but I'm pretty sure you shouldn't use #8 wire for anything more than a 40 amp circuit (so 32 amps continuous), even if it "feels fine". Talk to an electrician to be sure - try the aforementioned ebay seller (William Korthof); he's a licensed electrician with a ton of experience with EVs/EVSEs.

 

[fooljoe]

If you buy the cs-60 from ebay, can you Still claim the 30% fed Tax incentive And having a private electrician do the install?

I see no reason why not.

 

[yblaser]

Thanks for the advice, guys!

 

[TonyWilliams]

Did an extended charge couple days ago to see how many miles I would end up with. After 5+ hours it finished (with 148 mi range-is this about right?) and the breaker wasn't even warm that I could tell... with my calibrated finger!

The range on the GOM is contingent on how you drove previously. I've had 146 miles which is the default (41.8 kWh * 3.5 miles per kWh), but I've also had 80-ish miles. And everything in between.

Again the GOM entirely depends on what happened previously.

 

[AvLegends]

Thanks Mike. No I'm not having it inspected, so I don't have to do things by the book. I did install a 60A breaker so I want to make sure the wire can handle 60A. I guess I could switch the breaker out to 50A to make myself feel better. For my own edification I want to understand why people are recommending #4 when all the tables say #6 should be fine. Is this a another 125% rule where you want the breaker 125% of the expected current and the the wiring to handle 125% of the breaker current? BTW it is a 25 ft run to the sub panel so there should be no issues with voltage drop.

Yes, it's something like the 125% rule. The tables cited here don't necessarily apply to a continuous load like charging an EV. One thing to note about that table is it says #14 wire is good for 20 amps, but I know for a fact you need #12 wire for a 20 amp circuit. Even if you're not having it inspected, I'd want to make sure everything's up to code just in case something (fire) happens. And after seeing what happened with Tony's Blink/Rav4 combo it's not like a fire is an impossibility; even if something else was actually at fault I wouldn't want to give your insurance company any reason to deny your claim.

I'm not sure what the code is for the wire size for a 60 amp circuit, but I'm pretty sure you shouldn't use #8 wire for anything more than a 40 amp circuit (so 32 amps continuous), even if it "feels fine". Talk to an electrician to be sure - try the aforementioned ebay seller (William Korthof); he's a licensed electrician with a ton of experience with EVs/EVSEs.

Good catch on the #12 vs #14 for 20A... I agree 100%. Please, as mentioned above, talk to a licensed electrician to be sure what will work for your installation.

 

[AvLegends]

Did an extended charge couple days ago to see how many miles I would end up with. After 5+ hours it finished (with 148 mi range-is this about right?) and the breaker wasn't even warm that I could tell... with my calibrated finger!

The range on the GOM is contingent on how you drove previously. I've had 146 miles which is the default (41.8 kWh * 3.5 miles per kWh), but I've also had 80-ish miles. And everything in between.

Again the GOM entirely depends on what happened previously.

Thanks Tony. That's sort of what I was thinking. The more I drive the more the GOM will take into account past driving history and habits.

Each charge results in a little less range. Today it shows 117 mi. on a standard charge.

 

[TonyWilliams]

To drive at the default 3.5 miles/kWh is painful!!!!

 

[AvLegends]

Didn't Waidy get something like 5-5.5 miles/kwh? I think she got 175 miles on an extended charge but said "don't follow Waidy...you would get very impatient following Waidy"

 

[TonyWilliams]

Didn't Waidy get something like 5-5.5 miles/kwh? I think she got 175 miles on an extended charge but said "don't follow Waidy...you would get very impatient following Waidy"

I average the typical 3.4 down the freeway at 65mph (obviously, this value would be far lower with heater use) and 2.7 in town.

I will try a 200 mile run this summer, though, which will require 200 / 40 = 5.0 miles per kWh or better.

 

[waidy]

To drive at the default 3.5 miles/kWh is painful!!!!

I think it is more painful to follow a driver driving 3.5 miles/kWh

Didn't Waidy get something like 5-5.5 miles/kwh? I think she got 175 miles on an extended charge but said "don't follow Waidy...you would get very impatient following Waidy"

Yes, don't follow me or you will be very unhappy.

 

[TonyWilliams]

When I get home from Italy in a few weeks, I will have a modified 2013 Nissan / Panasonic portable EVSE (different from the 2011-2012 units) that can select from 4 amps up to 20-ish amps, at 100 to 250 volts, and a Tesla Model S portable adjustable "up to" 40 amp EVSE, also 100 to 250 volts.

With both of them, I can charge at virtually any single phase electrical source at the maximum current and voltage that the power source can provide.

 

[waidy]

When I get home from Italy in a few weeks, I will have a modified 2013 Nissan / Panasonic portable EVSE (different from the 2011-2012 units) that can select from 4 amps up to 20-ish amps, at 100 to 250 volts, and a Tesla Model S portable adjustable "up to" 40 amp EVSE, also 100 to 250 volts.

With both of them, I can charge at virtually any single phase electrical source at the maximum current and voltage that the power source can provide.

Please let us know after you get the Model S mobile connector working. I am interested of the instruction of connecting the cable with the J-connector.

 

[khaliss]

Got the CS-60 today... had to get it from ebay with their regular pricing. Looks brand new, can't wait to get this installed.

 

[Noel Ingle]

Ordered a Leviton 40A unit for $1100 from Home Depot website on Saturday. Just got it yesterday. Should I be looking at the CC CS-60? Is it cheaper?
Thanks

 

[VQ EV]

I picked one up in LA Saturday from the EBay guy for $725 (still a good deal with no shipping) on the way to buying my blue Rave4 EV. Looks like new. I have to change the wiring from the 40 amp I have for my 2 year old Blink (POS). I had a 40 amp Clipper creek installed in Dec 2010 for my Leaf because the Blink was not out yet. I had it for about 2 months and it worked perfectly. I never had range anxiety but with the Blink I've always had charge anxiety. About once a month something would go wrong and it wouldn't have charged (timer in car set to end charge at 4:30 AM for super-off peak rate). The Clipper Creek never failed (but I hear the charger timer in the Rav4 EV has issues. I will be charging mostly at work (except weekends) with the Leaf on the CS-60 (wife has no charging at work).

 

[khaliss]

Without knowing the specifics of your install I would ask an electrician as to what is code for your area. I would want things to be properly sized as to the breaker and wire used. Looks like #8THHN is good for 55A from the chart below. Talked to my electrician and he said the #8 is for THHN only. Otherwise it would be #6. THHN has finer strands and allows for a higher rating.

I have the CS-60 sitting and waiting to be hooked up... and the wait will probably be another week. Although the electrician didn't specify what gauge he used, my guess is it's a #8 copper (and not THHN). If I swap the breaker with a 50A unit, and hook up the CS-60... do you think the #8 copper will work? (considering it's only a 9-feet run) and I'm only charging a Rav4-EV (which draws only 40amps)?

 

[AvLegends]

Without knowing the specifics of your install I would ask an electrician as to what is code for your area. I would want things to be properly sized as to the breaker and wire used. Looks like #8THHN is good for 55A from the chart below. Talked to my electrician and he said the #8 is for THHN only. Otherwise it would be #6. THHN has finer strands and allows for a higher rating.

I have the CS-60 sitting and waiting to be hooked up... and the wait will probably be another week. Although the electrician didn't specify what gauge he used, my guess is it's a #8 copper (and not THHN). If I swap the breaker with a 50A unit, and hook up the CS-60... do you think the #8 copper will work? (considering it's only a 9-feet run) and I'm only charging a Rav4-EV (which draws only 40amps)?

That's how I installed mine... #8 THHN with a 50A breaker. Not going to charge anything bigger than the Rav4 EV at 40 amps. Just be sure to keep your Tesla Model S friends off your CS-60 or you will be poppin breakers.

One thing I noticed though... is that the box you are going to wire the CS-60 to? Your pigtails hanging out look pretty short. You need to have enough wire so you can work. I have my CS-60 hardwired directly to the box. Good luck.

The CC CS-60 is such a nice unit that i'm going to get another for the garage here at home.